The Tulipan Hungarian Dancers                           
				present                                         
										
			     "TREE OF LIFE"                                      
										
										
			    with guest dancers                                  
										
			KODALY ENSEMBLE OF TORONTO                           
				   and                                          
		       BOKRETA ENSEMBLE OF MONTREAL                         
										
		       Saturday, February 24, 1996.                             
				  7:00pm                                          
										
			  De La Salle High School                               
		(first right off St. Patrick, East of King Edward)              
										
		Tickets are:  $10.00 for Adults                                 
			      $ 8.00 for Seniors/Students                       
			      Children under 12 are free.                       
										
     Afterwards you will be able to taste the Hungarian Debreceni, and         
     
 Hungarian Pastries which will leave your mouth watering.  You will also be    
 
     able to take part in a traditional Dance House Party, "Tanc Haz".         
     
										
      Join us for an evening of whirling skirts and stomping rhythms!          
      
										
 For more information contact:                                                 
 
 Susan Blackburn at 233-6791                                                   
           
 Kati Deczky at 728-9971                                                       
        
 Christina Magyar at 828-1197                                
										
The Tulipan Hungarian Dancers eagerly await your participation and willingly
	   accept generous Charitable Donations from the public.  
			     THANK YOU!

Hello,


a legujabb kiada'su' (kiza'ro'lag EUROPAI sti'lusu')
DISCO CD-ket e's/vagy TAPE-eket valamint VIDEO-kat 
keresem megve'telre --folyamatosan--.

Ha valamilyen mo'don tudna'l segi'teni,
ke'rlek i'rja'l a ko"vetkezo" E-MAIL cimre:

   [Toronto, Canada]


Laci,

Hello,

a legujabb kiada'su' (kiza'ro'lag EUROPAI sti'lusu')
DISCO CD-ket e's/vagy TAPE-eket valamint VIDEO-kat 
keresek megve'telre --folyamatosan--.

Ha valamilyen mo'don tudna'l segi'teni,
ke'rlek i'rja'l a ko"vetkezo" E-MAIL cimre:

   [Toronto, Canada]

Laci,

Hey,Miszczak,who the fuck cares?

Kedves Gotthard,

>Kedves Peter,
>Bar megertem hogy egy olcso poent kihagyni nehez, ez a fajta hozzallas 
>nem hiszem hogy sokban hozzajarulna egy tartalmas tarsalgas 
>kialakulasahoz. Ha nincs sajat, pozitiv velemenyed a soc.culture.magyar 
>vagy a FAQ fellenditeserol, talan jobb lenne ha legkozelebb a fentihez 
>hasonlo sorok helyett semmit sem kuldenel be.

Valoban nehez kihagyni, foleg ha oly sok az alkalom. Termeszetesen lehet, hogy 
akar mindenkinek jobb lenne ha nem irnek, de nekem nem. Attol tartok a 
soc.culture.akarmik funkciojarol nezeteink gyokeresen elternek. Talan 
megkockaztatom, hogy nem itt fogjuk megvaltani a vilagot. Meg nem is volna 
igazsagos, hogy listserverek tonnaszam nyomhatjak ide a szemetet csak en nem 
viccelodhetem itt a magam olcso modjan. (Bar az igazsag mint tortenetunkbol 
kiderul a Usenetnek nem resze.)

Az olcso poenok mellett volt uzenet is, ami talan elfelejtodott, igy idezem 
magamat:
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
Erdekes, hogy pont a leghangosabb "demokratak" nem ertik, hogy valakit nem 
lehet "lemondatni" arrol, hogy informaciot tegyen kozze, es nem lehet 
kenyszeriteni, hogy ha errol ir, irjon arrol is.
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------

>A masik intelligenciajanak 
>megsertese ...

Remelem nem sertem meg az intelligenciajat kedves Gotthard ha kimutatom, fenti 
mondata fabol vaskarika. Szereny nezetem szerit megsertheto az ember 
erzekenysege, buszkesege, onbecsulese vagy egyszeruen onmaga, viszont 
intelligenciaja csak fizikai eszkozokkel, teszem azt, baltaval roncsolvan az 
agysejteket.
Mit szolna egy "a masik intelligenciajaba vetett hitenek megsertese" 
fordulathoz?

A trefa kepes talan meg a legdemokratabbakat is oldani neha.

>Udvozlettel,
>Gotthard

Udvozli: SzP.



--------------------------------------
Peter Szaszvari
http://iap11.ethz.ch/users/szp/szp.htm
--------------------------------------

In article >,  (Alex
ander N. Bossy) writes:
|> On Feb 10, 1996 00:39:47 in article <The Hungarians in Transylvania>,
|> 'Anthony Malczanek >' wrote: 
|>  
|> >After World War I, the Treaty of Trianon in 1920:  Transylvania  
|> >becomes part of Romania. 
|> >Hungarians living in this area become a minority. 
|>  
|> Hi Anthony: 
|>  
|> You've got to be careful in what you say.  While the Hungarians were the
|> politically dominant population in Transylvania (as they were throughout
|> the Hungarian half of the Dual Monarchy) before Trianon, they in no way
|> constituted anything approaching a majority of the population in
|> Transylvania (nor in the Kingdom of Hungary, for that matter). 
|> Consequently, they did not "become minority".  They had been, and continued
|> to be, a minority. 
|>  
|> Alexander

Hi Alexander!

There is one thing (at least) I don't really understand concerning these thread
s:
why should the Hungarians (and those writing from a non-Romanian point of view)
 be
the ones who "have to be careful in what" they "say". Anthony made a statement
he believes. You cannot prove by any means that Romanians have always been the
majority in Transylvania. I don't know about any historical evidence proving 
this up to very close to Trianon (and then it still was a rather close call).
So I think you should also be careful in stating that Hungarians "had been and
continued to be a minority" in Transylvania, because their minority status
has only developed as the result of the sneak-invasion (migration) of Transylva
nia
by Romanians. So I think that this kind of interventions of yours are purely
propagandistic. They no way fit into the picture of many other postings of your
s.

Regards,

Matyas
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In article > Oliver Fiorini,
 writes:
>The subject of  the so- called "political correctness" pops ups from time to
>time.

>It has been practiced by dictators, religious leaders, crusading newspaper
>editors, petty tyrants, and  wild eyed and narrow minded minions of smarter
>self serving leaders, since humans have lived in groups larger than families. 
 

Believe or not: it origins from China, form taoism. It is thought that
when 
a bad thing got a new name the bad thing became better (in best
case:good).

It seems it does not work however. Only the new word becomes pejorative
very fast.

Tamás

 (Heikki Koivusaari) writes:
> 
>  Well who cares if he brings down his country, you think Holland is anywhere 
> near the top when using so many blacks in their NATIONAL team? I just laugh 
> looking at your pathetic excuses for players. I mean really, can't you find 
> someone just as good who is actually dutch?
> 
> 
> 
>  Sieg Heil! :)
> 

Is this guy for real?

All black players in the Dutch national are Dutch! Holland
has a multi-racial society for many years. Something you can't
imagine. You're the pathetic one here, asshole.

Frank (Ajax rules, everywhere)

The great myth about the expulsion of the Silicone Crew from HIX keeps
growing and evolving.  The story gets more dramatic and exciting by the 
week, with the evil forces of censorship lined up against Toth, Szucs, 
and the rest of the clones.  Every last one of them a veritable martyr of 
free speech, fighting the good fight to the end.  Since a sucker is born 
every minute, I suppose there might be someone out there ready to fall for 
this version.  The truth is far more prosaic.  Like most of the stuff 
pouring forth from silicone.com, the Great Censorship Story is a hoax.  
Dr Pellionisz & Co were kicked out for theft, pure and simple.

Since "Joseph Toth" bills himself as a publisher, one would assume he must
have heard of the notion of copyright.  This concept is defined by the
Berne Convention, and applies in the same way in all signatory countries.
Essentially, you as a publisher have the right to publish three kinds of 
material:

 - stuff written (and automatically copyrighted) by yourself;
 - stuff that is in the public domain;
 - stuff published by permission of the copyright owner.

Note that the only things in the public domain are the work of long dead
authors, and stuff explicitly placed in the public domain by the copyright
owner.  The materials "borrowed" by NEMZET were emphatically not in the 
public domain.  Everything published since 1989 anywhere in the civilized 
world is automatically copyrighted, whether or not it carries a copyright 
notice.

One of the copyright owners whose material was regularly purloined (the 
Batthyanyi Foundation, or BLA for short) protested repeatedly and in public, 
to no avail.  Dr Pellionisz and his cohorts reacted with the usual mix of 
red herrings and twisted logic, and the NEMZET kept pushing the stolen 
material as if nothing happened.  Their line was (and is) that since BLA 
itself was reprinting material originated elsewhere, the stuff was free 
for the taking, by NEMZET or anyone else.  This is patently false.  Either 
BLA had permission from the original copyright owners, or it did not.  If 
it did, this permission did not extend to the NEMZET.  If it did not, then 
the material in NEMZET was pirated twice over.

At this point, either the Batthyanyi Foundation or the owner of hungary.com
(a commercial publisher distributing BLA under contract) could have taken
legal action against the silicone folks.  They did not.  (Note that 
copyright violations involving over 10 copies, and a commercial value over 
$2,500, are felonies under U.S. law.  Smaller amounts are subject to civil 
penalties.)  This made the editors of NEMZET even bolder, and they started 
lifting stuff from HIRMONDO, an electronic journal distributed through
the facilities of HIX.  At this point, even Jozsi Hollosi (a person with 
the patience of Job, and skin as thick as an elephant's hide) took offense,
and decided to act.  Instead of calling a lawyer, he made his point by 
deleting Dr Pellionisz and his crew from the HIX subscriber lists, and 
forwarding all incoming mail from them to the great bit bucket in the sky.  

Since then, Mr "Toth" and crew have been wasting their time fulminating 
against HIX, and spinning ever more baroque myths of censorship, with a
tortured scenario involving ancient tales of conspiracies at the time
of the taxi blockade of 1990.  I believe that's the right year.  Rather 
than wasting time on these delusional theories, Mr "Toth" could do
something constructive, like boning up on copyright law.  

If you know nothing about the topic, a good place to start is the home page 
of Brad Templeton, the founder of ClariNet.  ClariNet is an electronic 
publishing house with 1,200,000 paid-up subscribers.  They must be doing
something right.  As a budding publisher, Mr "Toth" might learn something 
from a guy who has been making a living from electronic publishing since 
1989.  I especially recommend Brad's paper "10 Big Myths About Copyright 
Explained".  It is written in layman's language, without the usual lawyerly 
gobbledygook.  You'll find it at <http://www.clari.net/brad/copymyths.html>;.

Once you digested Brad's paper, you will be ready to move on to the more 
demanding material in the Copyright Law FAQ, and the actual language of the
law accessible through the Web at the Library of Congress site.  Brad has
all the pointers set up for you.  Just click to find out about more 
advanced topics, such as the concept of "fair use".  And if you are still
unclear on the concept, then you might try one of the many extension 
courses on copyright and publishing offered by universities, adult schools,
and community colleges everywhere.  It is never too late to start picking 
up on these things.  If the whole editorial staff of NEMZET were to enroll 
together, you might even get a group discount.  

-----
Gabor Fencsik

In article >, 
 (Heikki Koivusaari) writes:

> : Please make some distinction, Tamas. Maybe all of the opponents are booed,
> : but strangely enough the boos are much (very much) louder when a black
> : player has got the ball. This was also noted by Anderlecht, where the
> : black players had to face similar treatment in Hungary. It's a real shame
 
>  Marco, why is it that you love black players so much in Holland? Maybe it's 

Because they play good football.

> hard for you to understand, but some supporters would like to see their teams
 
> stay as they are. Eastern Europe is the next area that will soon start signin
g 
> a lot of africans etc... and quite honestly, no matter how good a player is, 
> some people just can't see them as part of their team. It takes all the fun 
> out of the game, having a black player is nothing... but when 1/2 the team is
, 
> it's just crap! I want to see my hometeam as a team i can identify with, not 
a 
> team of people i have NOTHING in common with, except that i pay their wages b
y 
> paying for the ticket. 

Those "black players" are Dutch.  Most of them are born in the country (of
the current Dutch squad, I think only Winter was not, and he grew up in
Amsterdam as well).  They happen to be part of our culture, and most Dutch
(there are some exceptions, alas) couldn't care less about the colour of
their skin.  We also had a player of Chinese descent in our team once, in
case you're interested (Tshenla Ling).

To say that you have *NOTHING* in common with another human being because of
his colour betrays you as racist.
  
For your information, as far as I know the only non-Dutch-born Ajax players
are two Nigerians and a Finn.  I'm sure you want the Finn back.

>  Well who cares if he brings down his country, you think Holland is anywhere 
> near the top when using so many blacks in their NATIONAL team? I just laugh 
> looking at your pathetic excuses for players. I mean really, can't you find 
> someone just as good who is actually dutch?

You really don't get it, do you?  Don't worry, our fifth team would still
easily beat Finland's best.  

>  Sieg Heil! :)

I suppose one could imagine contexts in which this quotation warrants a
smiley, but the above try falls short by a considerable margin.  You're 
not by coincidence befriended with one Alfred Roesberg? 

Karel
-- 
-- Karel Stokkermans, RISC-Linz, Schloss Hagenberg, Austria, Europa
 -- email: 
  -- url: http://info.risc.uni-linz.ac.at:70/1/people/kstokker
   -- rsssf: http://info.risc.uni-linz.ac.at:70/0h/misc-info/rsssf/nersssf.html
"O hoe vergeefs / des doelmans hand / zich strekte naar de bal    [  21-6-88,  
]
 die 'een minuut / voor tijd de Duitse / doellijn kruiste..."     [ J. Deelder 
]

--
"Nemzet" negotiated with Batthyany-Foundation the use of their material,
both by phone and fax. No objection. To "third party volunteers", meddling
in a BLA-Nemzet issue, the message is brief: "mind your own business".
--

A magyar olvaso jol sejti, hogy Fencsik miert nyergelt at fogadatlan
prokatornak. Bizony felettebb kenyelmetlen hogy Fencsik "a szelsojobb
szokott dajkamesejenek" nevezte, hogy a Taxisblokad az SZDSZ es szemelyesen
Peto muve volt - viszont a baloldali hivatasos hirszerzo Szatmari Jeno
Istvan koronatanunak jelentkezett konyvevel, cafolva Fencsiket.

Egyszeru eldonteni, hogy a HIX olcso urugynek fabrikalta-e a "Nemzet"-ben
is szereplo hazai hiranyagok mondvacsinalt problemajat, vagy a HIX valojaban
Szucs Andras haromszor bekuldott "Szatmari-idezetet" igyekezett kicenzurazni:
http://www.siliconvalley.com/nemzet/951226.html

(1) Az olvaso gyozodjek meg rola, hogy a HIX minden nap "utankozli", sajat
HIX neve alatt, az SCM anyagat holott -Fencsik szerint- ezt copyright
jelzes nelkul
sem szabadna megtennie!

(2) Az olvaso piszkalja csak meg a Szatmari-konyv dokumentumait a Forumon,
s figyelje vajon a cenzor engedi-e? Fencsik e temat meg itt is nagy gonddal
keruli, a HIX-en pedig mindeddig mindvegig tabu volt!

Meg ha lenne is barmi valos ok a HIX onhatalmu "megtorlasara" (pedig nincs),
az akkor is tokeletesen etikatlan a "siliconvalley" domain olyan hasznaloi
ellen, akiknek semmi, de semmi kozuk sincs sem a Nemzet/Bla, sem pedig a
Szatmari/Taxisblokad ugyhoz. Az MIT osszes diakjat sem volna etikus
eltiltani
az Internettol pl. azert mert Hollosi az MIT.EDU-n naponta utankozli ezt a
Soc.Culture.Magyar-t!

Joseph Toth

In article >, 
T. Kocsis > writes:

> In article > Rad Edelstein, 
> writes:
> >World Soccer - Feb 96 coments on page 30:
> >"Now Ferencvaros have to qualify again and keep the momentum going
> >while sorting out the racist element which has attached itself to the
> >club and behaved so disgracefully during Ajax's visit."
 
> >Does anybody know what this refers to?
 
> Yes. There got too many poor clubs too near to the big money to en-
> danger the income of some rich west-europian clubs. So they tried

As if Ajax minded playing Ferencvaros.  5-1, 4-0.

> everything to force the unwanted competition out. AFAIK, Ukraine
> were disqualified this way..

They tried to bribe a referee.  Stupid.
 
> Back to the Hungarian team. There was no fascism at all during

The issue was racism rather than fascism, but never mind.

> Ajax's visit. The Hungarian fans always boooo-s regardless of the
> colour or nationality of the opponent. All the opponents are booed.

You're either deliberately lying or incredibly ignorant.  There were
distinct monkey sounds whenever a black Ajax player had the ball.

That is not to say that Ferencvaros supporters are all racists (but a
small minority apparently is, like at other clubs), not that Ajax
handled the matter in any mature manner (it indeed smacked of hypocrisy).

> It is a Hungarian thing. Well, we don't riot, don't destroy ships,
> don't break everything when our team lost....

There were riots after the 1994 Hungarian cup final, and when you played
Slovan Bratislava, to name but two well-documented examples.  I don't
say that Ferencvaros supporters were the main culprits in either case,
but you can't say there isn't a hooligan element at Fradi.  Unfortunately.
 
> It is disgusting that this denigration was started by a man who during
> his active days as soccer player spitted into the face of an other player
> during a match. I think he did not have the moral ground to do it.

Frank Rijkaard wasn't even in Budapest.  The whole moral indignation came
from coach Louis van Gaal and president Michael van Praag.  Both not
lacking a bit of double standards, it's true.

You are probably referring to that letter in Marca (or As).  Rijkaard
signed it, along with Johan Cruijff and e.g. Jan Timman.  That letter
was indeed a remarkably foolish thing, but Rijkaard certainly did not
start it.

As for judging Rijkaard from the Voeller incident only, that is very
shortsighted at the least.
 
Szia,
Karel
-- 
-- Karel Stokkermans, RISC-Linz, Schloss Hagenberg, Austria, Europa
 -- email: 
  -- url: http://info.risc.uni-linz.ac.at:70/1/people/kstokker
   -- rsssf: http://info.risc.uni-linz.ac.at:70/0h/misc-info/rsssf/nersssf.html
"O hoe vergeefs / des doelmans hand / zich strekte naar de bal    [  21-6-88,  
]
 die 'een minuut / voor tijd de Duitse / doellijn kruiste..."     [ J. Deelder 
]

The name Sencer sound me German/Austrian name. You may try
soc.culture.austrian to get further info.

The Fazendin sounds very exotic and I can not figure out any si-
milarity to Hungarian names. Are you sure that it is original
and not a mispelled (by USA immigration office) version ?

Tamás

Greetings,

I am looking for suggestions for traditional Hungarian Valentine's gifts for a 
lady, i.e. what would a young Hungarian woman like to receive.

In view of the timing, quick replies will be most appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

Doug

I saw a 5 minute report on CNN Headline News the other night stating that 
there is a huge year-long festival planned for Budapest this 
year...making it the most interesting time to visit this century.  1100 
years...is that age of Budapest or of Hungary?

My great-grandfather was a town official in Ujfeherto in the early part 
of the century and was murdered by the Horthy regime.  He left a lengthy 
ethical will, which is in a classical form of Hungarian with some Hebrew 
and Yiddish words mixed in.  I am looking for someone who is qualified 
and willing to translate this (and who could do so at a reasonable 
rate).  Can anyone help?

The Company I work for has just been re-named:
"Lucent Technologies" - formerly a part of AT&T.

The word "lucent" is not in my English-Hungarian 
dictionary.  Can someone translate for me, please.

Thank you.  Koszonom.

Robert

Haho, siliconosok! A kovetkezo siliconos level feladoja
 lesz, vagy mi a fene? ;-)

Gergo

Korrekt politikai musor a TV-ben?

Tegnap, vasarnap, a Fur Lajost vagy egy oran keresztul beszeltettek
a TV-ben. Semmi szokasos, ellenzeki politikusnak kijaro belepofazas,
semmi komolyabb inszinuacio, semmi szelsosegesezes, antiszemitazas.

Nem ismertem ra a TV-re. Tenyleg ilyan jo lenne az uj media torveny?
Lovass Istvan kicenzurazasa csak kezdeti vegrehajtasi nehzseg volt, a 
rossz ertelmezes es nehany ostoba utovedharc kovetkezmenye?

Vagy mas, meg egy paktum, meg egy kis arulas?

Mi a velemenyetek?

Tibor

Odor Tibor